nice one pare..

i'm not a believer...

That is a weak analogy...

I have a question.... Isn't Philippines dominantly a Catholic Country that is also considered third world?

Can someone explain to me why majority of it's citizens are struggling in their everyday life? The very same people who donated their last savings to their church in hope God will answer their prayers?

What more must these people do to be heard by God? Sacrifice their first born?

Anyway.. I see no reason at all why the barber is used to prove God's existance... An analogy of a mortal being existance against the Immortal being existance... That in my opinion is weak.

Same with religions.

Religion is a tool, just like Science you have mentioned.

In fact religion is a powerful tool used by politicians to win votes.

1. Lumalabas sa tanong ni Sublime: Sa Diyos dapat i-sisi ang paghihirap ng nakararami sa atin?

2. Lumalabas sa tanong ni Sublime: Pinababayaan ng Diyos ang mga naghihirap?

3. Lumalabas sa tanong ni Sublime: Kung talagang may Diyos, bakit marami ang naghihirap?

Diyos ba ang gumawa ng kahirapan o ang Tao? Diyos ba ang magsusubo ng pagkain sa tao? Diyos ba ang hahanap ng pagkain para sa tao?

Sa kaginhawahan lang ba natin dapat kilalanin ang Diyos at hindi na sa kagipitan?

Ano sa palagay ninyo? Kung lahat ng tao ay mayayaman. Sa palagay nyo ba'y maaari mo siyang utusan para magtapon ng basura? Maaari ba siyang utusan para maglinis ng kalye at ng iyong tahanan? Maaari mo ba siyang utusan para magtanim sa bukid? Maaari mo ba siyang utusan para ihatid kayo sa inyong pupuntahan? Maaari mo ba siyang utusan para gumawa sa inyong pagawaan?

Ito lang ang obserbasyon ko kung ano ang susunod na tanong ni sublime: Bakit hindi sugpuin ng Diyos ang sanhi ng kahirapan.

Ang magiging sagot ko, tama si Sublime. Para lahat tayo ay YUMAMAN.

Salamat.

i do... thats y i fear

sublime i think u have misconceptions about God and Christians.

When you are a christian it doesnt mean you will instantly have a good life. quite the contrary. Because the devil is after you. Christian life is way harder than a non-believer. I mean Christians suffer persecution everywhere. The devil doesnt really care so much about non-belivers kasi he knows na theyre going to be with him na.

Jesus said: "Who ever wants to follow me, take up their cross and follow me", "Whoever lives their live will lose it, but whoever loses their life for me will have it"

I'd like to respond to what you have just said.. But, I haven't got the slightest clue what you just said.

But, by the look of it, you took my statement literally. Just like you taking every word in the bible literally without understanding what the words trully means and what they represents.

My statement was not solely about the living standard of the philippine people. I used the word STRUGGLING as a collective which includes pain and suffering.

So, let me rephrase my previous statement in basic english.

Religion is part of the philippine peoples life. Some are more dedicated than others and yet some of them are still struggling in life, NOT just financial (which maxtomax failed to grasp) but also includes their physical and emotional conditions... Famine and disasters.

Does your God enjoy watching your fellow countrymen suffer?

I am sure there are a lot of filipinos out there that deserves the life you live more than you.

It's not a misconception in my behap. But, like the previous poster. You took my statement too literally.

Anyway.. from what you just said, you are implying that you have to crawl on broken glass to get God's attention.

As for the Christian facing persecution everywhere... where did you get that from?

Since the middle ages Christianity had always been dominant in the Western World. They have also been heavy handed to those of different beliefs..... Unless you grew up in the Islam society.

I am not quite sure where you got your facts from.

Also, just FYI. non believers could care less if satan had reserved a room for them in hell. To us, neither God or Satan exist, let alone heaven and hell.

An atheist professor of philosophy speaks to his class on the problem science has with God, The Almighty.

He asks one of his new Christian students to stand and.....

Professor : You are a Christian, aren't you, son?

Student : Yes, sir.

Prof : So you believe in God?

Student : Absolutely, sir.

Prof : Is God good?

Student : Sure.

Prof : Is God all-powerful?

Student : Yes.

Prof : My brother died of cancer even though he prayed to God to heal him. Most of us would attempt to help others who are ill. But God didn't. How is this God good then? Hmm?

(Student is silent.)

Prof : You can't answer, can you? Let's start again, young fella. Is God good?

Student :Yes.

Prof : Is Satan good?

Student : No.

Prof : Where does Satan come from?

Student : From...God...

Prof : That's right. Tell me son, is there evil in this world?

Student : Yes.

Prof : Evil is everywhere, isn't it? And God did make everything. Correct?

Student : Yes.

Prof : So who created evil?

(Student does not answer.)

Prof : Is there sickness? Immorality? Hatred? Ugliness? All these terrible things exist in the world, don't they?

Student :Yes, sir.

Prof: So, who created them?

(Student has no answer.)

Prof : Science says you have 5 senses you use to identify and observe the
world around you. Tell me, son...Have you ever seen God?

Student : No, sir.

Prof : Tell us if you have ever heard your God?

Student : No , sir.

Prof : Have you ever felt your God, tasted your God, smelt your God? Have you ever had any sensory perception of God for that matter?

Student : No, sir. I'm afraid I haven't.

Prof : Yet you still believe in Him?

Student : Yes.

Prof : According to empirical, testable, demonstrable protocol, science says your GOD doesn't exist. What do you say to that, son?

Student : Nothing. I only have my faith.

Prof : Yes. Faith. And that is the problem science has.

Student : Professor, is there such a thing as heat?

Prof : Yes.

Student : And is there such a thing as cold?

Prof : Yes.

Student : No sir. There isn't.

(The lecture theatre becomes very quiet with this turn of events.)

Student : Sir, you can have lots of heat, even more heat, superheat, mega heat, white heat, a little heat or no heat. But we don't have anything called cold. We can hit 458 degrees below zero which is no heat, but we can't go any further after that. There is no such thing as cold. Cold is only a word we use to describe the absence of heat. We cannot measure cold. Heat is energy. Cold is not the opposite of heat, sir, just the absence of it.

(There is pin-drop silence in the lecture theatre.)

Student : What about darkness, Professor? Is there such a thing as darkness?

Prof : Yes. What is night if there isn't darkness?

Student : You're wrong again, sir. Darkness is the absence of something. You can have low light, normal light, bright light, flashing light....But if you have no light constantly, you have nothing and it's called darkness, isn't it? In reality, darkness isn't. If it were you would be able to make darkness darker, wouldn't you?

Prof : So what is the point you are making, young man?

Student : Sir, my point is your philosophical premise is flawed.

Prof : Flawed? Can you explain how?

Student : Sir, you are working on the premise of duality. You argue there is life and then there is death, a good God and a bad God. You are viewing the concept of God as something finite,
something we can measure. Sir, science can't even explain a thought. It uses electricity and
magnetism, but has never seen, much less fully understood either one. To view death as the opposite of life is to be ignorant of the fact that death cannot exist as a substantive thing. Death is not the opposite of life: just the absence of it. Now tell me, Professor. Do you teach your students that they evolved from a monkey?

Prof : If you are referring to the natural evolutionary process, yes, of course, I do.

Student : Have you ever observed evolution with your own eyes, sir?

(The Professor shakes his head with a smile, beginning to realize where the argument is going.)

Student : Since no one has ever observed the process of evolution at work and cannot even prove that this process is an on-going Endeavour, are you not teaching your opinion, sir? Are you not a scientist but a preacher?

(The class is in uproar.)

Student : Is there anyone in the class who has ever seen the Professor's brain?

(The class breaks out into laughter.)

Student : Is there anyone here who has ever heard the Professor's brain, felt it, touched or smelt it?.....No one appears to have done so. So, according to the established rules of empirical, stable, demonstrable protocol, science says that you have no brain, sir. With all due respect, sir, how do we then trust your lectures, sir?

(The room is silent. The professor stares at the student, his face unfathomable.)

Prof : I guess you'll have to take them on faith, son.

Student : That is it sir.. The link between man & God is FAITH. That is all that keeps things moving & alive.

eto lang masasabi ko:

The more you deny God, the more you prove His Existence. You cannot deny something unless there is some thing to be denied of.

I do believe in God..

Sublime,

"It's not a misconception in my behap. But, like the previous poster. You took my statement too literally."

if this is so then what are you trying to imply with your statements??

"Anyway.. from what you just said, you are implying that you have to crawl on broken glass to get God's attention."

no. i am not implying that. And you dont have to get God's attention, because He always has you attention. Just saying lives of Christians are not easy.


"As for the Christian facing persecution everywhere... where did you get that from?"

We never hear them because people just dont see them as important. You must about missionaries in islamic countries being killed. You might not know this but in Iraq, they are planning to have a law that means one member in each Christian family will be killed. NOW HOW IS THAT NOT PERSECUTION!?. The sad thing is the US wont help them. At least when Saddam was still in leadership he protected Christians in Irap in some way. However since the US has handed leadership to the Iraqis this can very well happen. There are 1 million Christians in Iraq and 40,000 have already fled for their lives. Furthermore, neighbouring countries of Iraq are all Islamic. There is just no escape.

"Since the middle ages Christianity had always been dominant in the Western World. They have also been heavy handed to those of different beliefs..... Unless you grew up in the Islam society."

This statement does not apply to me. I think you have generalised. I happen to tolerate other religions. This is just a matter of the idividual's opinion on other beliefs.

Also, just FYI. non believers could care less if satan had reserved a room for them in hell. To us, neither God or Satan exist, let alone heaven and hell."

I dont believe i made myself clear. I didnt say non believers dont care about satan because that's obviously the case. I said the satan doesn't really care about non-believers becase he knows where they are going.

So you dont beliver in some sort of afterlife?? what about spirits and ghosts or some sort of spiritual being??

~~~~~

"Does your God enjoy watching your fellow countrymen suffer?"

of course not. He weeps when we weep. He is with us through our pain. It is not God who does these things. however He lets it happen because He wants to test our faith. if we are with Him till the end. Just like Job.

"I am sure there are a lot of filipinos out there that deserves the life you live more than you."

Thats absolutely right! makes you feel really blessed.

hehe basic english.

I'm implying that God does not exist. If he does, then he is one cruel being.

If you have never heard of them how on earth did you know anything about it?

I have also stated from my previous post... and I quote

Noticed I stated "UNLESS" you grew up in the islam society... It is obvious that christianity will face presecution in the Islamic country... It works both ways. Muslims will face just about the same things in a Christian country.

Generalise? It's a proven fact through history... Anyway... I wasn't asking whether or not you tolerate other religions. The argument was about the statement you made concerning Christians being persecuted "everywhere" which is entirely untrue.

And, yes, this is a matter of individual's opinion and their beliefs. Thats why this is a discussion about our beliefs in God.

It was crystal clear... I just don't see the point of having to make that statement on someone that does not believe in heaven and hell.

Just like Individuals who uses quotes in the bible to make his/her arguments against an atheist... Any man can quote from a book, but very few can truly speak up through their mind, knowledge, and experience.

No, I do not believe in afterlife nor do I believe in ghost, spirits, or any form of spiritual beings. They are all but a pigment of our imagination.

Bah! that's just for religious individuals... I don't need it. What I have accomplished in life are my own doings without divine intervention. So far I think I'm doing pretty well.

Hehe I think "Job" is a wrong sample. There are a lot of people out there that hate their job. That's just like saying, believe in God eventhough you hate him.

Anyway...

Do you have faith in God?
Faith in the bible?
Is your faith strong enough to die for God?

Do you have any wishes that God can help you fulfill?

Actually, denying the existance of God means exactly that. Denying the existance of God.

Hehe that's just like what confucius say.. "If a tree falls in the forest when there is no one around to hear it, does it make a sound?"

What is the benchmark of your beliefs in God?

Sa aking palagay, kahit na medyo sumama ang aking loob sa mga paratang ni Sublime sa aking Panginoon, na siya ay nagagalit sa Diyos... kung inyong babasahin ang kanyang mga isinaysay, makikita na galit sa Diyos at hindi kawalan ng paniniwala... nawa'y maintindihan niya ang sinabi kong ito... kung hindi man ay maghanap siya ng taong makakapagsalin nito sa wika niyang naiintindihan...

Why is He cruel? does this go back to the issue of the many pilipinos suffering?? If it is so it is not God's fault. It's the enemy

hehe i shud have reworder it to : we do not hear much news about them. anyway this news was in the Herald Sun last friday (i guess u have a different one u live in sydney right??)

Who says christians dont suffer persecution in a non-islamic country. It doesnt have to bne something big like christians are being killed. Even the stereotyping of christians as 'biblebashers'. anywayz personal opinion

I respect you opinion sublime

You certainly deserve you life then because im telling you the taxi drivers in the philippines who work for 14 hourse straight are working as hard or even harder than you but they can never get the life that you have. And there are people who are born into a rich family that end up having cancer or sumthing. I dont believe in luck. so i wont say you're lucky. But you certainly have it going for you.

Oh i am so sorry i am talking about a person in the bible called Job. hehe i didnt make myself clear.

ok i will tell you something that i hope you will respect (because my friend told a person this in a nother forum and they laughed, which has caused her to think badly of that person)

I am not as experienced in life. i am only 15 (hope you wont lauch because this guy did and he was really mean to my friend) anyway bak to your q's

YES i have faith in God. He is there always to guide me.
YES i have faith in the bible. It is God's word.
The answer to your question is very hard. I havent been in a situation where my life was threatened because of my faith. but i have faced persecution (not as bad though) What i know is I love Him. The answer to your q then is yes.

"Whoever lives their life will lose it, but whoever loses their life for me will gain it"

wishes?? prayers. yeah im doing a talk for a chapel service at my school on thrusday. i need Him to do the talking.